LegCo Sitting (Minutes) 5 March 1997

LegCo Paper No. CB(3)701/96-97

THE LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL

MINUTES
No. 22 of 1996-97
Minutes of the sitting held on Wednesday 5 March 1997 at 2:30 pm

Members present:

    President -- The Honourable Andrew WONG Wang-fat, OBE, JP
    The Honourable Allen LEE Peng-fei, CBE, JP
    The Honourable Mrs Selina CHOW LIANG Shuk-yee, OBE, JP
    The Honourable Martin LEE Chu-ming, QC, JP
    Dr the Honourable David LI Kwok-po, OBE, LLD(Cantab), JP
    The Honourable NGAI Shiu-kit, OBE, JP
    The Honourable SZETO Wah
    The Honourable LAU Wong-fat, OBE, JP
    The Honourable Edward HO Sing-tin, OBE, JP
    The Honourable Ronald Joseph ARCULLI, OBE, JP
    The Honourable Mrs Miriam LAU Kin-yee, OBE, JP
    Dr the Honourable Edward LEONG Che-hung, OBE, JP
    The Honourable Albert CHAN Wai-yip
    The Honourable CHEUNG Man-kwong
    The Honourable CHIM Pui-chung
    The Honourable Frederick FUNG Kin-kee
    The Honourable Michael HO Mun-ka
    Dr the Honourable HUANG Chen-ya, MBE
    The Honourable Emily LAU Wai-hing
    The Honourable LEE Wing-tat
    The Honourable Eric LI Ka-cheung, OBE, JP
    The Honourable Fred LI Wah-ming
    The Honourable Henry TANG Ying-yen, JP
    Dr the Honourable Samuel WONG Ping-wai, OBE, FEng, JP
    Dr the Honourable Philip WONG Yu-hong
    Dr the Honourable YEUNG Sum
    The Honourable Howard YOUNG, JP
    The Honourable Zachary WONG Wai-yin
    The Honourable Christine LOH Kung-wai
    The Honourable James TIEN Pei-chun, OBE, JP
    The Honourable LEE Cheuk-yan
    The Honourable CHAN Kam-lam
    The Honourable CHAN Wing-chan
    The Honourable CHAN Yuen-han
    The Honourable Andrew CHENG Kar-foo
    The Honourable Paul CHENG Ming-fun
    The Honourable CHENG Yiu-tong
    Dr the Honourable Anthony CHEUNG Bing-leung
    The Honourable CHEUNG Hon-chung
    The Honourable CHOY Kan-pui, JP
    The Honourable David CHU Yu-lin
    The Honourable Albert HO Chun-yan
    The Honourable IP Kwok-him
    The Honourable LAU Chin-shek
    The Honourable Ambrose LAU Hon-chuen, JP
    The Honourable LAW Chi-kwong
    The Honourable LEE Kai-ming
    The Honourable LEUNG Yiu-chung
    The Honourable Bruce LIU Sing-lee
    The Honourable LO Suk-ching
    The Honourable MOK Ying-fan
    The Honourable Margaret NG
    The Honourable NGAN Kam-chuen
    The Honourable SIN Chung-kai
    The Honourable TSANG Kin-shing
    Dr the Honourable John TSE Wing-ling
    The Honourable Lawrence YUM Sin-ling
Members absent:
    The Honourable James TO Kun-sun
    Dr the Honourable LAW Cheung-kwok
    The Honourable Mrs Elizabeth WONG CHIEN Chi-lien, CBE, ISO, JP
Public officers attending:
    The Honourable Mrs Anson CHAN, CBE, JP
    The Chief Secretary
    The Honourable Donald TSANG Yam-kuen, OBE, JP
    The Financial Secretary
    The Honourable Jeremy Fell MATHEWS, CMG, JP
    The Attorney General
    Mr Michael SUEN Ming-yeung, CBE, JP
    Secretary for Home Affairs
    Mr CHAU Tak-hay, CBE, JP
    Secretary for Broadcasting, Culture and Sport
    Mr Dominic WONG Shing-wah, OBE, JP
    Secretary for Housing
    Mrs Katherine FOK LO Shiu-ching, OBE, JP
    Secretary for Health and Welfare
    Mr Peter LAI Hing-ling, JP
    Secretary for Security
    Mr KWONG Ki-chi, JP
    Secretary for the Treasury

Clerks in attendance:

    Mr Ricky FUNG Choi-cheung
    Secretary General
    Mr LAW Kam-sang
    Deputy Secretary General
    Mrs Justina LAM CHENG Bo-ling
    Assistant Secretary General (2)
    Mr Ray CHAN Yum-mou
    Assistant Secretary General (3)



Papers

The following papers were laid on the table pursuant to Standing Order No. 14(2):

Subsidiary LegislationL.N. NO.
1. Road Traffic (Public Service Vehicles) (Amendment) (No.3) Regulation 199769/97
2. Census and Statistics (Quarterly Survey of Service Industries) (Amendment) Order 199775/97
3. Official Languages (Alteration of Text Under Section 4D) (No.4) Order 199776/97
4. Official Languages (Alteration of Text Under Section 4D) (No.5) Order 199777/97
5. Official Languages (Alteration of Text) (Fire Services Ordinance) Order 199778/97
6. Official Languages (Alteration of Text) (Mining Ordinance) Order 199779/97
7. Official Languages (Alteration of Text) (Water Pollution Control Ordinance) Order 199780/97
8. Shipping and Port Control Regulations (Amendment of Tenth Schedule) Notice 199781/97
9. Noise Control (Amendment) (No.2) Ordinance 1996 (61 of 1996) (Commencement) Notice 199782/97
10. Hong Kong Airport (Control of Obstructions) Order 1997 (L.N. 16 of 1997) (Commencement) Notice 199783/97
11. Waste Disposal (Amendment) Ordinance 1997 (10 of 1997) (Commencement) Notice 199784/97
12. Official Languages (Authentic Chinese Text) (Stowaways Ordinance) Order(C) 10/97
13. Official Languages (Authentic Chinese Text) (Mock Auctions Ordinance) Order(C) 11/97
14. Official Languages (Authentic Chinese Text) (Post Secondary Colleges Ordinance) Order(C) 12/97
15. Official Languages (Authentic Chinese Text) (Immigration Service Ordinance) Order(C) 13/97
16. Official Languages (Authentic Chinese Text) (Hotel Accommodation Tax Ordinance) Order(C) 14/97
17. Official Languages (Authentic Chinese Text) (Law Reform (Miscellaneous Amendments) Ordinance) Order(C) 15/97
18. Official Languages (Authentic Chinese Text) (Fire Services Ordinance) Order(C) 16/97
19. Official Languages (Authentic Chinese Text) (Monetary Statistics Ordinance) Order(C) 17/97
20. Official Languages (Authentic Chinese Text) (Roads (Works, Use and Compensation) Ordinance)Order(C) 18/97
21. Official Languages (Authentic Chinese Text) (Water Pollution Control Ordinance) Order(C) 19/97
22. Official Languages (Authentic Chinese Text) (Mining Ordinance) Order (C) 20/97
23. Official Languages (Authentic Chinese Text) (Radiation Ordinance) Order (C) 21/97

Sessional Papers 1996-97

No.71 -The Hong Kong Institute of Education
Annual Report 1995-96 and Financial Report 1995-96

Questions

1. Mr SIN Chung-kai asked Question 1.

    The Secretary for the Treasury replied.

    Four Members asked supplementaries and the Secretary for the Treasury replied.

2. Mr LEUNG Yiu-chung asked Question 2.

    The Secretary for Home Affairs replied.

    Five Members asked supplementaries and the Secretary for Home Affairs replied.

3. Mr LAW Chi-kwong asked Question 3.

    The Secretary for Security replied.

    Four Members asked supplementaries and the Secretary for Security replied.

4. Mr MOK Ying-fan asked Question 4.

    The Secretary for Health and Welfare replied.

    Two Members asked supplementaries and the Secretary for Health and Welfare replied.

5. Miss Emily LAU asked Question 5.

    The Secretary for Security replied.

    A Member asked one supplementary and the Secretary for Security replied.

6. Mr K K FUNG asked Question 6.

    The Secretary for Housing replied.

    Two Members asked supplementaries and the Secretary for Housing replied.

    Written replies to Questions 7 to 15, 17 and 19 were tabled for Members’ information.

Government Bills

First Reading

Supreme Court (Amendment) Bill 1997

Places of Public Entertainment (Amendment) Bill 1997

Volunteer and Naval Volunteer Pensions (Amendment) Bill 1997

Crimes (Amendment) Bill 1997

The Bills were read the first time and ordered to be set down for Second Reading pursuant to Standing Order No. 41(3).

Second Reading

Supreme Court (Amendment) Bill 1997

The Attorney General moved the Second Reading and addressed the Council.

Question on the Second Reading proposed. The President stated that in accordance with Standing Orders, the debate was adjourned and the Bill was referred to the House Committee.

Places of Public Entertainment (Amendment) Bill 1997

The Secretary for Broadcasting, Culture and Sport moved the Second Reading and addressed the Council.

Question on the Second Reading proposed. The President stated that in accordance with Standing Orders, the debate was adjourned and the Bill was referred to the House Committee.

Volunteer and Naval Volunteer Pensions (Amendment) Bill 1997

The Secretary for Health and Welfare moved the Second Reading and addressed the Council.

Question on the Second Reading proposed. The President stated that in accordance with Standing Orders, the debate was adjourned and the Bill was referred to the House Committee.

Crimes (Amendment) Bill 1997

The Secretary for Security moved the Second Reading and addressed the Council.

Question on the Second Reading proposed. The President stated that in accordance with Standing Orders, the debate was adjourned and the Bill was referred to the House Committee.

Enduring Powers of Attorney Bill

Resumption of debate on Second Reading which had been moved on 8 January 1997.

Question on Second Reading put and agreed to.

Bill read the second time and committed to a Committee of the whole Council.

Powers of Attorney (Amendment) Bill 1996

Resumption of debate on Second Reading which had been moved on 8 January 1997.

Question on Second Reading put and agreed to.

Bill read the second time and committed to a Committee of the whole Council.

Fire Safety (Commercial Premises) Bill

Resumption of debate on Second Reading which had been moved on 29 May 1996.

Mrs Selina CHOW spoke on the motion.

At 4:17 pm, Miss Margaret NG drew the attention of the President to the absence of a quorum. The President directed that the Council be suspended and Members be summoned. A quorum was then present.

The Secretary for Security replied.

Question on Second Reading put and agreed to.

Bill read the second time and committed to a Committee of the whole Council.

Auxiliary Forces Pensions (Miscellaneous Amendments) Bill 1997

Resumption of debate on Second Reading which had been moved on 22 January 1997.

Question on Second Reading put and agreed to.

Bill read the second time and committed to a Committee of the whole Council.

Committee Stage

The Council went into Committee and considered the following Bills:

Enduring Powers of Attorney Bill

Question that the following clauses stand part of the Bill proposed.

Question on clauses 1 to 4, 6 to 12 and 15 to 19 put and agreed to.

The Attorney General moved amendments to clauses 5, 13 and 14 and addressed the Committee.

Question on the amendment proposed, put and agreed to.

Question that clauses 5, 13 and 14, as amended, stand part of the Bill put and agreed to.

Powers of Attorney (Amendment) Bill 1996

Question that the following clauses stand part of the Bill proposed.

Question on clauses 1, 2 and 3 put and agreed to.

Fire Safety (Commercial Premises) Bill

Question that the following clauses and schedules stand part of the Bill proposed.

Question on clauses 1, 2, 4, 9, 17 to 20 and 23 put and agreed to.

The Secretary for Security moved amendments to clauses 3, 5 to 8, 10 to 16, 21, 22 and 24 and addressed the Committee.

Question on the amendments proposed, put and agreed to.

Question that clauses 3, 5 to 8, 10 to 16, 21, 22 and 24, as amended, stand part of the Bill put and agreed to.

New clause 25 read the first time.

The Secretary for Security moved the Second Reading of new clause 25 and addressed the Committee. Question on the Second Reading of new clause 25 proposed, put and agreed to.

New clause 25 read the second time.

The Secretary for Security moved the addition of new clause 25 to the Bill. Question on the addition proposed, put and agreed to.

The Secretary for Security moved amendments to schedules 1 and 2 and addressed the Committee.

Question on the amendments put and agreed to.

Question that schedules 1 and 2, as amended, stand part of the Bill put and agreed to.

Auxiliary Forces Pensions (Miscellaneous Amendments) Bill 1997

Question that the following clauses and schedule stand part of the Bill proposed.

Question on clauses 1 to 25 put and agreed to.

Question on the schedule put and agreed to.

The Council then resumed.

Third Reading

The Attorney General reported that

the Enduring Powers of Attorney Bill

had passed through Committee with amendments and

the Powers of Attorney (Amendment) Bill 1996

had passed through Committee without amendment. He moved that the these two Bills be read the third time and do pass.

Question on the Third Reading of the two Bills proposed, put and agreed to.

Bills read the third time and passed.

The Secretary for Security reported that

the Fire Safety (Commercial Premises) Bill

had passed through Committee with amendments and

the Auxiliary Forces Pensions (Miscellaneous Amendments) Bill 1997

had passed through Committee without amendment. He moved that the these two Bills be read the third time and do pass.

Question on the Third Reading of the two Bills proposed, put and agreed to.

Bills read the third time and passed.

Members' Motions

International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights

Dr John TSE moved the following motion and addressed the Council:

That this Council urges the Chinese Government to enter into the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights and the International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights as a signatory as soon as possible, to fulfil its obligations under the Covenants to ensure that the residents in Mainland China and Hong Kong can enjoy the basic rights which are recognized internationally, and to continue to report to the United Nations on the human rights situation in Hong Kong after 1 July 1997.

Question on Dr John TSE's motion proposed. The President stated that Mr MOK Ying-fan had given notice to move an amendment to the motion and that Mr NGAN Kam-chuen had also given notice to move an amendment to Mr MOK's proposed amendment. He proposed that the motion, the amendment and the amendment to the amendment be debated together in a joint debate. There being no dissenting voice, the President ordered that the motion and the amendments be debated together in a joint debate.

Mr MOK Ying-fan moved the following amendment to Dr John TSE's motion and addressed the Council:

To add "in order to implement Article 39 of the Basic Law" after "That,"; to delete "the Covenants" and substitute with "these two international covenants"; to delete "Mainland China and"; to insert "continue to" before "enjoy the basic rights"; to delete "which are recognized internationally" and substitute with "prescribed therein after China resumes the exercise of sovereignty over Hong Kong".

Question on Mr MOK Ying-fan's amendment to Dr John TSE's motion proposed.

Mr NGAN Kam-chuen moved the following amendment to Mr MOK Ying-fan's proposed amendment and addressed the Council:

To delete "in order to implement Article 39 of the Basic Law," after "That,"; to delete "urges" after "this Council" and substitute with "is pleased to learn that according to the spokesman of the Chinese Ministry of Foreign Affairs,"; to delete "to enter" after "the Chinese Government" and substitute with "is actively considering entering"; to delete "as soon as possible, to fulfil its obligations under these two international covenants to ensure that the residents in Hong Kong can continue to enjoy the basic rights prescribed therein after China resumes the exercise of sovereignty over Hong Kong, and to continue to report to the United Nations on the human rights situation in Hong Kong after 1 July 1997" after "as a signatory".

Question on Mr NGAN Kam-chuen's amendment to Mr MOK Ying-fan's amendment proposed.

A Member spoke on the motion and the amendments.

At 5:00 pm, the President's Deputy took the chair during the temporary absence of the President.

Another 11 Members spoke on the motion and the amendments.

At 5:59 pm, the President resumed the chair.

Nine further Members spoke on the motion and the amendments.

The President invited Mr MOK Ying-fan to speak for the second time on Mr NGAN Kam-chuen's amendment.

Dr John TSE spoke on the amendments.

The Secretary for Home Affairs spoke on the motion and the amendments.

Question on Mr NGAN Kam-chuen's amendment to Mr MOK Ying-fan's amendment put. The President stated that he thought the amendment had been negatived.

Mr NGAN Kam-chuen and Mr CHAN Kam-lam claimed a division. The President then ordered the Council to divide under Standing Order No. 36(4).

The President announced that there were 26 votes for the amendment and 28 votes against it. (Voting record in Appendix I.) He declared that Mr NGAN Kam-chuen's amendment to Mr MOK Ying-fan's amendment was negatived.

Question on Mr MOK Ying-fan's amendment to Dr John TSE's motion put. The President stated that he thought the amendment had been negatived. Mr Frederick FUNG and Mr Bruce LIU claimed a division. The President then ordered the Council to divide under Standing Order No. 36(4).

The President announced that there were 14 votes for the amendment and 37 votes against it. (Voting record in Appendix II.) He declared that Mr MOK Ying-fan's amendment to Dr John TSE’s motion was negatived.

Dr John TSE replied.

Question on Dr John TSE's motion put. As the President could not judge from the voice votes whether the 'ayes' had it or the 'noes' had it, he ordered the Council to divide under Standing Order No. 36(4).

The President announced that there were 24 votes for the motion and 26 votes against it. (Voting record in Appendix III.) He declared that Dr John TSE's motion was negatived.

Role of Chinese Communist Party in the Hong Kong Special Administrative Region

Miss Christine LOH moved the following motion and addressed the Council:

That, in the light of the fact that the Chinese Communist Party openly plays a leading role in governing China, this Council urges the Government to seek clarification from the Chinese Government and the Chief Executive Designate about how the Party will be represented in the Hong Kong Special Administrative Region, what its role in the Region will be, what channels of liaison it will maintain with the Government of the Region and with the Chief Executive, and what the content and limits of that liaison will be.

Question on the motion proposed.

Seven Members spoke on the motion.

Miss Christine LOH replied.

Question on the motion put. As the President could not judge from the voice votes whether the 'ayes' had it or the 'noes' had it, he ordered the Council to divide under Standing Order No. 36(4).

The President announced that there were 25 votes for the motion and 25 votes against it. (Voting record in Appendix IV.) The President stated that he had previously exercised his casting vote in accordance with Speaker DENISON's decision in 1867. He then exercised his casting vote in the negative and declared that Miss Christine LOH's motion was negatived.

Next sitting

In accordance with Standing Orders, the President adjourned the Council until Wednesday 12 March 1997.

Adjourned accordingly at five minutes past eight o’clock.

(Andrew WONG)
President
Council Chamber
Hong Kong


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